Isn't it annoying that we need to make mistakes like these ourselves before we can actually learn something? For me at least, it’s like I need to get painfully burned by something before my brain opens up. Most likely, bumpy road processes like these are unavoidable, especially when learning and trying new things.
I made this video in the hope that by describing the fearsome Form-and-perhaps-Function trap, perhaps some of you could avoid falling into it. If the Marble Machine X can provide that lesson, that’d be great! :)
Stop reading so many self help books, you have a unique perspective towards whatever you do, don't muddle it with other people's perspectives, it is a unique part of your personality which your supporters like, you're good just like you are. You are skilled enough and you just need to trust yourself. ROME wasn't built in a day.
Hi Martin here's a book that might inspire you: Henry Petroski The Evolution of Useful Things: How Everyday Artifacts-From Forks and Pins to Paper Clips and Zippers-Came to be as They are
You have lost all my respect hear...look at the citys of old thay were boring ...o wait...just because it's hard dosnt mean bad...art is soul ...it's what I loved in the build...o well now I can buy a meal instead of show tickets when you tour
It doesn’t have to be perfect. The Marble Machine itself is a stupidly overcomplicated machine for what it does: Play Music. But that’s that’s great about it, it’s ridiculous, but it works.
You are a monster 😁
Here I get to see you notice problems, fix them and keep pushing forward, and that's the most exciting part. Whatever you decide on, I am proud of what you do because I am supporting not engineer Martin but Martin as a great musician. I'm really looking forward to seeing you at a live concert!
Bro. Just let me move there. I will shoot all videos, cook your food, and clean up the workshop every day so you can focus on the MMX-T
sorry, but i won't idolize musk.
In today's world, so full of efficiency, optimization and time constraints, the MMX is one of the few projects where dreaming is still possible. The MMX is so good because it is driven by idealism and ruthless optimism. If the world needed an efficient marble machine, many engineers with a decent education could build a much more reliable solution than the MMX within a year, but nobody would care about that machine. The MMX is so fantastic because it is a fantasy come true, and that's where its value and facinations comes from.
Yes Martin, you can use a funnel/path or whatever to move the marbles from Point A to Point B, but it will never be as cool as magnetizing and demagnetizing, same goes for all other functions of this masterpiece you are building. Do you even remember the automated violin machine you've showcased in the past? MMX is one of those machines too, even in its current state. Take a step back and reflect, don't let art get overshadowed by optimizations...follow your heart.
I thought I had already made my comment. Apparently I had not. Martin, you're not building a car. You're not building a rocket. Stop treating art and passion as "simple" engineering. Nobody here is here because they want to see some stripped down, soulless version of your idea. I want you to go back, and watch the video of your original marble machine. I want you to go back and *HONESTLY* watch it. You created it. You know every flaw with it. You saw first hand how the whole thing wobbled and rocked, and how it wasn't perfect and it wasn't a tenth of what you've accomplished or a thousandth what you've learned since. ... you know every flaw, but tell us, tell every one of us here that what you made was bad, or insignificant, or wrong. It was, and is art. We all loved it or we wouldn't have come here. Your machine is not a mistake. *Losing sight of your original vision is.* __Why did you start on the MMX?__ Because I seem to remember you wanted to make a better version of the marble machine. You wanted to make something beautiful, and fun. Everything I just heard is neither of those things. Also, Musk is a terrible example to follow under almost all circumstances. If you're going to follow the advice of someone, try a physicist. try Richard Feynman. "Physics is like sex: sure, it may give some practical results, but that's not why we do it." - Feynman
Was that “optimistic music,” Oh Canada?
Form (Always) Follows Function!
The Walt Disney Concert Hall could be considered a successful exception to this dull mantra though eh? Or the Sidney Opera House - designed to look like waves.
Talking about trying to optimize something that shouldn't exist: Musk's rocket is exactly that: trying to optimize something that shouldn't exist. Sending millionaires into space is totally useless.
"Function over form" the beauty of form should be a result of the beauty of the functional solution.
My dude. Your too close to the finish line to give up theres no solution to this problem? Just think of the list of ingenious solutions. It seems like one more solution away.
Good for you! As someone who has been casually following your work for years, I think it’s great that you are striving towards narrowing your focus in order to do deep work. As much as I enjoy your videos, I’d rather see you go “video silent” for a year or two to make real progress than see you be sidetracked by making extra videos and dragging it out for several more years. Best of luck to you!
Thanks Martin, I needed this
As others have stated, you're chasing the dumbest of dumb requirements: perfection. DO NOT CHASE PERFECTION. You will never achieve it.
Hire someone to make the videos. I think you may be underestimating just how much people look forward to watching this channel. It might be a story that we're really invested in, not necessarily a perfect machine.
we all out here dissing on martin for dissing on martin. no one can diss martin. not even martin.
Looks need to be last maybe with the looks you can change the colour and the looks of the new parts (maybe new parts) put in colour for parts it would make it look nice bc it seems you are having bad times with the parts you can replace the parts and colour them like the MMX no one would mind also if ur having promblems I just want to say look at the marble machine what made it work if you want to this to happen you look like you like the looks it’s fine no one minds about change no one cares about looks they care about it actually going on please it’s good for you to take a break as well you are overwhelmed maybe take a break of 5/3/4 months at least
It's been too long, don't care anymore...
god speed martin, the "real machine" will still be done befopre star citizen releases
Ironically enough when you say you don't want to kill your darlings this is exactly what I am told to do when I'm designing videogames. Yes, it's really hard, but sometimes moving past what you're fixated on will let you move forward and make tangible progress. Hope you can break a habit almost all engineers and designers have faced one way or another!
If you're making that marvel x machine more performance type let me know I want to hear more music from it please get it finished so I can hear more music in the fool beautiful music
Secretly Martin just likes building things more than touring now and just wants to keep engineering in his nice French house!
There's first an idea, then you do simulations followed by prototypes to debug design. You then do environmental testing to may sure your design can be robust enough to work under the conditions expected and then you make sure it can above such expected conditions (alpha). Finally you build the beta and repeat so that you know your processes are sound as well as test the beta. Once beta is finished, you sell product (or, in your case, conduct the world tour). lol 3rd times the charm is actually good engineering, W. I know the simplified Gantt I spieled is just that; simple, but it was the flow I followed when I actually was an EE. Now I'm a bum, but for 10.5 years, the flow served me well. :)
*This clock was not grown here. @21:13
Can't wait for MMXT! Form from function... or just build a nice box around it when you're done. All the best!
I'd say: -"enough perfecting it - time to use it for creating music".
Editing your design requirements doesn’t have to necessitate a complete rework of the design. For instance, you can choose to replace problem parts with ones that are more functional but slightly less appealing or choose to have a tolerance of X amount of marbles per minute of runtime. In engineering, we often end up loosening our requirements and allowing for a certain amount of error because many of us are perfectionists and try to remove all error in systems that can allow for some safe errors. At the end of the day, the goal is to make things as simple as possible. One thing that is hammered into your head as an engineer in both school and industry is K.I.S.S : Keep It Simple, Stupid.
I first saw the original Marble Machine video not on TRvision, but at the Ars Electronica festival in Linz in 2016. It was amazing, but I remember wishing I could see the machine in person and meet the creator. That's the venue where it belongs, not a music stage, not a rocket launch pad. It's more than an instrument, and more than a feat of engineering. What captured my attention was the machine itself, not the music it was playing (although the song is very catchy) or the person playing it. I know how hard it is to make a technically-complicated art project (I helped make some of the main exhibits for that festival.) You always feel like bugs arise faster than you can fix them. But you must keep in mind the goal, which I believe is not to make a machine that works incredibly reliably, or looks really cool - those are both means to the true end: the ultimate purpose is to convey a new idea to inspire people. As long as you accomplish that, you are successful. MMX will absolutely do that, even with its current problems. It already has inspired so many people through this channel. The only "dumb design constraint" is the venue for the machine and the way you intend to present it, not the reliability metrics or aesthetics. It's a work of love and art - let it shine as such.
Y’all still posting this 2 wks old vid? 🤔 I guess I just did same. Lol
I know the pain. From the beginning, when I saw you make those decisions I knew you would fail. However, I still watched your videos having hope you were wrong :) This "convergence" period, to make something theoretical work reliable is practice is cruel and sometimes needs a wonder to be possible. And sometimes it needs a start from the scratch. Hope you will get there. Eventually.
honestly this is just so stupid. the machine is nearly complete and works great. throwing all of that away just to reach "perfection" is just ridiculous. even if you design a new machine from the ground up, it will never reach perfection. Also just finish the damn thing and enjoy having it.. make an album, go on tour.. and THEN start the process all over again. By starting over right away you will start from scratch all over again.. you will be tangled in the assembly and design process for the next 2-3 years or even longer.. you will be completely burned out.. just leave it be for now.
Well, you have just earned a plethora of respect from me. Your self-questioning and willingness to listen to the truths you don't want to hear have inspired me to do the same. From my perspective, you've already achieved that 'godly' status. I think you know very well what the difference is between being a Professional, and being the Ultimate Master and I sense that you know by heart that you are meant to be the latter. May you always be Blessed in abundance. Muchly appreciated - Leo, South Africa.
I read the book… essentialism, probably the worst book you could’ve read as an artist. Sure it’s got some truths that you can apply certain areas of your life and work. But it’s an absolutely de-motivator to creativity! Martin I’m so disappointed! I never thought you’d give up I see this video as you quitting. Everyone’s right you need to make the best of what you have, we want to see you tour with what we’ve watched you build. Quite honestly if it plays five minutes at a concert I’d be thrilled. You’re an amazing artist, composer, and musician I would buy tickets just for that alone. However, It wouldn’t be the same if you had some other mmx machine that someone else built as your instrument during any concert.
I stopped watching your channel because I just could not stand to see somebody of your talent run in circles, stop chasing perfection its a illusion no system is ever perfectly simple while being perfectly functional there is always a trade off, I think where you got lost is you kept chasing this illusion of this ideal machine that simply can not exist in our reality, the only thing I ever wanted to see out of this my self is it play the original marble machine tune in its entirety thats it if you continue trying over and over to reach this state this vision of this perfectly mechanical device then you are doomed for failure at some point you must make the decision to just be happy
Seeing what you've done and somehow you've made me respect you even more. Not easy to admit what you did. Well done.
Elon Musk has never been the most intelligent entity in any room he has been in that has contained either another human being or one of the more trainable dog breeds.
Does this mean you will not be filming your progress? I think you have been extremely productive with this project. You have inspired a huge communities of followers that love your work no matter what it is. Why do you feel like you are not achieving your life goals? I always thought your passion was to create then share that creation to the world. Weather that be a song, an instrument, or a TRvision video. You have developed an amazing habit of making something and sharing it. Doesn't matter if the thing is done, you share your joy of the creation and it inspires thousands around the world. I've been following your channel sense 2014 and I feel like I'm catching up with an old friend every time you post a new video. I'm loosing an old friend if this is you saying good by.
This project is starting to smell like a bad Kickstarter. Makes me sad to watch you overthink this when you were getting so close.
Hey this guy is pretty cool
Is any part of the MMX going to be utilised in the new project? Things like the fish stair and droppers work really well
WTF is wrong with all the bots posting on almost everyone's comments with names and pictures asking for sex? like wtf ...
I like how the optimist music is the Canadian Anthem
SUCH A SHAME YOUR COMMUNITIES ARE NOW BEING REPLIED TO BY PORN SPAMMERS FOR SEO! LOOK AT WHO'S REPLYING TO YOUR COMMUNITY MEMBERS ON YOUR VIDEOS!! IS ANYONE ELSE GETTING THESE REPLIES?
@Louis Cabrera No one is moderating the comments, allowing people to copy/paste 'replies' to trick algorithms for monetary gain. It probably happened before too, but moderated? IDK. These sex workers don't care though, it's a numbers game, post 1000, have 500 deleted, they still got 500 out there working the SEO for their sex ads. Do not reply to their replies either, just delete your original comment. EITHER WAY, MARTIN IS AN INSPIRATION, BUT WHAT A SHAME!!
What is happening with Wintergatan? This place of TRvision used to be very clean and was a big pleasure to watch Martin's videos.
Martin, i really still have to say, you may need a little mental break. Because marble machine X is already so close to striving its goal and then some. If people really wanted accuracy and efficiency, why would they still enjoy and enamour your old marble machine video till this day? Almost everyone loved it. even with all its falling marbles.
Martin! She plays! MMX plays! Personally, I consider that a win.
아이언맨도 마찬가지로 mk1, mk2를 거쳐서 mk3를 만든 것처럼 이 몇년간의 대장정을 끝내고 다음 머신을 만들면 될탠데..
If we think about it, if we strip it to its basic idea, what’s the goal of this machine? Not to be an industrial music instrument that everyone’s going to play, but one machine that can play the vibraphone, drums and bass with marbles using a kind of free drop and catch system. Perhaps it’s useful to focus on this and streamline towards that. BUT at the same time, I think there is an additional goal, which is to look cool and interesting while doing so. We should be able to see clearly the marbles going through the machine, as if this were the world’s most intricate pachinko. This has clearly been another central design goal of this machine and it’s worth keeping in mind. It’s okay to streamline if a part is way too hard to optimize. But that doesn’t mean that trying to build these quirks in was going off-track or nonsensical. On the contrary. It wasn’t over-engineering; it was chasing one of the core design goals of the MMX.
Wow, just wow. All the time so many people put in to this project and he is scrapping it. One song after all that work, not just by him, but probably hundreds of people.
Indeed, Will make me finally unsubscribe.
Exactly my thoughts.
Wintergatan Finally remembered his password
You just inspired me to apply these principles in my life and get back to creating. Thank you Martin.
The problem is Elon is also pretty dumb, so you can just erase most of his advice unless it's on how to order people to do things, or on how to build things that were already made decades before and claiming to be the first to do it.
@Mark2theD Him too
I think you meant Steve Jobs and Apple...haha
I see Weakness and frustration
This IS your world tour!.... You have just dropped a marble on stage and confessed your self doubts......Now embrace your fans cheers.... And.. pick that marble up...
One of my favorite realizations is when you’re channel pops back up in my recommended. I take a break so that way I can just binge all of the new updates you have made on the MMX. Each video shows how thought out and intricate you want it to be, even going as far as to completely redesign an already made feature of the MMX. The point is do not beat yourself up, you’re fans and supporters aren’t here to watch you fall and cheer that on. We’re here to watch you grow and finish you’re project. And even then we’ll still be here after when it is finished. Take these “mistakes” you made with a grain of salt and capitalize off of them. That being said this is you’re project, you’re magnum opus, you’re baby. If you feel it’s not up to the standards you have set for yourself then I encourage you to then set them to that standard and even beyond that.
Strange, I thought I was subscribed.
Came for the music and stayed for the engineering and wisdom.
I'm only 13 minutes into the video but I need to say, I think the magnetic lift mechanism is an identifying feature of the MMX. Please don't remove it. If you simplify it too much, you risk losing the character of what makes the marble machine special. There are simple ways to constrain the marbles so they don't explode and you've already solved many of the problems. Removing it now would be a huge mistake!
Look, as a writer I understand entirely about having to cut things that don't work or seemingly don't suit a purpose, but you have to know when you're going too far. The MMX is gorgeous to look at, and it's a piece of art for playing music first and foremost. Looking back on the original marble machine, the first one, its charm came from that home made feel of it. You could see the bits of wire molded and bent between screws, hell you even had lego technic pieces in the thing. The MMX is a natural progression. The machine itself is refined, but you've managed to maintain and even add spectacle. The magnetic lift is something that's amazing to look at, and cements this contraption as the art piece it is. Now obviously pipes bursting is bad, but if a few marbles fall along the way, don't sweat it, it's part of that charm. I think many people don't want you to give up on the MMX. If you do though, don't lose that artistic vision, don't engineer something that works but is devoid of personality, be cool, be inefficient, make art.
i guess it is time to tell you that Marble machine was never a musical instrument . it is just a beautiful noisy thing that can play music .
I figure feedback here is likely lost and it takes either Patreon or Discord to make a comment to have an impact. But I'll try a TRvision comment anyway and hope it gets seen. I think Martin is on the right track (no pun intended). The ideas that make up iterative design are often applied in the software world with testing being a cornerstone to help verify things. Later in the MMX process, I was happy to see much of that ethos get adopted. In particular was the use of computer programs to simulate ideas before trying to fab out a bit in a sort of unit test. And trying to rig the machine to limit functionality to just test something that was just built is a bit like integration testing though IMHO it still has a way to go. Lean into the successes with the CAD team and try to do more simulation if its possible. Do keep doing the unit testing. Look for more help[ with electromechanical aids like the motor used the drive the whole thing during testing. That basically replaces the input drive mechanism of Martin. I think the MMX was designed in such a way for these major assemblies to be broken down and able to be mocked up. The marble list, the programming wheel, the top marble return path, and the instrument bank seem to be the main assemblies that could have stand-ins created for them to test final sub-assemblies for the machine. I believe this would allow those assemblies to be iterated on and polished. If design decisions for other sub-assemblies cause too many issues, then it's possible to go back and iterate on those other sub-assemblies using the stand-ins and maybe allow the angle grinder to have a rest.
Tldr: Best part, is no part.
If ten marbles fall out during each song while you're on stage, who would know the difference? Aren't your shows more on the dark side as far as lighting is concerned anyway?
Just wanted to come back and say - if you wanted something that's well-engineered, why not just use a DAW?